>> Cathy: JOHN DONALDSON MAY BE THE GREATEST BASEBALL PITCHER YOU HAVE NEVER HEARD OF.

NEXT MONTH AT MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL'S WINTER MEETINGS, THAT COULD CHANGE.

DONALDSON APPEARS ON THE 2025 CLASSIC BASEBALL ERA COMMITTEE HALL OF FAME BALLOT.

THE NEGRO LEAGUE STAR TOURED THE COUNTRY PLAYING TOWN BALL FOR DECADES, INCLUDING IN MANY COMMUNITIES AROUND MINNESOTA.

HE PITCHED MORE THAN 600 GAMES, WINNING MORE THAN 400 OF THEM.

THE ONLY FILM THAT EXISTS OF JOHN DONALDSON IN UNIFORM IS THIS HISTORIC 39-SECOND-LONG FILM SHOT IN ERGUS FALLS IN THE SUMMER OF 1925.

HIGHLIGHTING THAT ARE FILM AND TELLING THE STORY OF DONALDSON'S CAREER HAS BEEN A DECADES-LONG PASSION PROJECT FOR BASEBALL HISTORIAN PETER GOTON.

WELCOME BACK TO THE SHOW.

>> SO GREAT TO BE HERE.

THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> Cathy: I LOVE VINTAGE FILM.

THAT IS A GREAT PIECE.

>> IT'S A WONDERFUL THING TO HAVE BECAUSE WE CAN SEE HOW HE THROWS THE BALL.

WE CAN TALK ABOUT PRINCE HONEYCUTT AND GREAT OLD BLACK BASEBALL PLAYERS, BUT, LOOK, WE CAN WATCH HIM AND HE COMES ALIVE AND THAT'S HELPFUL FOR HIS CASE.

>> UNKNOWN SUPERSTAR, HE HAD A GREAT CAREER.

>> HE CERTAINLY DID, HE'S KNOWN TO HAVE MORE WINS AND STRIKEOUTS THAN ANY SEGREGATED PLAYER IN THE HISTORY OF BASEBALL.

PLAYED 137 CITIES IN MINNESOTA, MORE THAN THE HALL OF FAMERS WE LOVE AND KNOW, MAUER, MOLITOR, WINFIELD AND JACK MORRIS COMBINED.

AND THIS IS EARLY 1900S.

JOHN DONALDSON IS A BASEBALL SUPERHERO AND PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW THAT.

>> Eric: YOU'VE BEEN AT THIS AT LEAST SINCE 2005.

WHAT'S THE HOLDUP?

WHAT'S THE DEAL AGAINST HIM GETTING IN?

>> WELL, MINDS HAVE CHANGED A LOT SINCE THEN ABOUT HIS GREATNESS AND WHAT WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO FIND OUT.

WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT SOMEBODY WHO'S A COOKIE CUTTER HALL OF FAME CANDIDATE.

THIS GUY IS A HUGE, HUGE PERSONALITY IN TERMS OF THE INTEGRATION OF BASEBALL.

AND THE INTEGRATION OF AMERICA >> Eric: HE WAS A SCOUT FOR THE WHITE SOX.

>> HE DEFINITELY WAS THE FIRST BLACK SCOUT.

HE BROKE THE COLOR-BARRIER IN MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL FOR SCOUTS.

1949, THE CHICAGO WHITE SOX -- THE BOLD THING OF ANNOUNCING THEY'VE HIRED AN AFRICAN AMERICAN SCOUT.

FIRST TIME IT HAD EVER HAPPENED AND IT WAS JOHN DONNALSON.

HE'S SO BIG IN TERMS OF THE INTEGRATION OF OUR NATION AND THE WAY THAT JACKIE ROBINSON CAME AFTER.

LOOK, WE'RE ON A BALLOT NOW WITH 7 OTHER PLAYERS.

7 OTHER GREAT PLAYERS.

YOU'RE NOT A COOKIE CUTTER BASEBALL PLAYER IF YOU MAKE A HALL OF FAME BALLOT AND THAT'S KIND OF LIKE COOKIES WE HAD HERE BEFORE, RIGHT?

ANYWAY, SO IF YOU'RE GOING TO BE -- THE ONLY PERSON ON THAT BALLOT THAT HAS THE GREATNESS OF JOHN DONALDSON IS TRULY HIM, RIGHT?

THE OTHER GUYS ON THERE OWE THEIR BALLOT TO JOHN DONALDSON'S LEGACY.

>> Cathy: WHY DON'T WE KNOW MORE ABOUT JOHN?

DO YOU THINK IT MIGHT ACTUALLY BE A LITTLE EASIER TO GET HIM INTO THE HALL OF FAME NOW THAT THE NEGRO LEAGUE RECORDS ARE PART OF BASEBALL HALL OF FAME HISTORY?

>> THAT DEFINITELY S PART OF IT.

THE ACKNOWLEDGMENT OF THE GREAT NEGRO LEAGUE BASEBALL PLAYERS, THAT'S CERTAINLY A PART OF GETTING HIM ON THIS BALLOT.

BUT HE DID ALL THESE THINGS BEFORE THE LEAGUE STARTED.

HE DID ALL THESE THINGS WHEN IT WAS MUCH MORE DIFFICULT TO INTEGRATE BASEBALL, AND HE DID IT ALL OVER THE UNITED STATES.

WE HAVE HIM IN 800 DIFFERENT TOWNS.

THIS IS WHAT SEGREGATION DID AND THE REASON WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT IT MORE IS SEGREGATION WORKED ON JOHN DONALDSON'S LEGACY.

THE REASON YOU DON'T KNOW WHO HE IS AND PEOPLE DON'T KNOW WHO HE IS IS BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T WANT HIM TO BE KNOWN.

THEY PUSHED HIM WAY OUT TO PLACES WHERE HE HAD TO GO PLAY THAT MAJOR LEAGUERS NEVER WERE.

BUT EVERYBODY THERE KNEW THAT HE WAS A MAJOR LEAGUE TALENT AND THEY'D COME OUT IN THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE.

WE HAVE GAMES THAT HE OUTDREW, GAMES THAT HE PITCHED IN OUTDREW GAMES THAT HAPPENED IN COMIN' SKI PARK IN CHICAGO.

AND THESE GAMES ARE HAPPENING IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE AND IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THAT JOHN DONALDSON'S LEGACY WAS SOMETHING EVERYONE ELSE BUILT OFF AND THIS IS WHY HE'S SIGNIFICANT IN THIS BALLOT.

THERE'S OTHER CANDIDATES IN THIS LIST THAT ARE GREAT BASEBALL PLAYERS BUT THE BASEBALL HALL OF FAME IS CHOCK-FULL OF THESE GUYS ALREADY.

OTHER ON THIS BALLOT, SIX OF THEM HAVE BEEN ON AT LEAST 18 BALLOTS 'TIL NOW.

THIS IS JOHN DONALDSON'S SECOND BALLOT.

ALL THESE OTHER GUYS HAVE BEEN LOOKED OVER, PARSED OVER, PICKED OVER FOR YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS AND WE'RE GETTING THE RESURGENCE OF JOHN DONALDSON A